Diana Kelter: Full Episode Transcript

On today's episode, I sit down with Diana Kelter, Director of Trends at Mintel, to reveal what CMOs need to know about Gen Alpha, kids aged 1 through 14. growing their buying power and shaping our culture. Between unpacking memes and Gen Alpha themes, you'll learn how to adjust your marketing strategy for a generation that's anti-algorithm, why brands are friends, and how they can reverse the affection deficit. and why the controversial American Eagle spot was good for their bottom line, despite the backlash. So grab your Stanley Cup and apply some Drunk Elephant. This episode has everything you need to reach the next generation.

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Diana Kelter: Diana introduction 

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00:00:54

Diana Kelter is a curiosity-driven trend spotter and the North American Director of Consumer Trends at Mintel. With a background in digital marketing, she brings a unique blend of data analysis and cultural observation to uncover what's next and help brands stay ahead of the curve. Fresh off her desk are Mintel's 2026 Global Consumer Predictions and the Lifestyles of Gen Alpha Report. Needless to say, we are thrilled to kick off the year with her. Diana, welcome to Question Everything. Thank you so much for having me. I am thrilled to be here. Anything that starts with curiosity, I am game. It's just like a match made in heaven already. I love it. It is. Also, I know we are going to talk a ton today about Gen Alpha.

00:01:41

I have three Gen Alpha girls, so I am super excited to learn a little something new. Hopefully, that I can like go home tonight and be like, 'Now I know what that means' or 'why you're doing that.' Diana told me all about this behavior. I also heard that you guys just launched the 2026 Global Trends Report as well. So, just like any hot nuggets there, you can share with the listeners? Yeah, that just launched October 9th. So, really hot off the press. And we have three global predictions that we're really excited about this year. And we did a little bit of a different spin this year. We're kind of looking ahead to 2030 and then focusing on the next as the really juicy part of this report, because that's the wear brands.

00:02:27

have the opportunity to shift where we're headed for 2030. and kind of shape the narrative. But the one that I think is really compelling, we have titled Anti-Algorithm. So really highlighting, we know algorithms are here. They're not going anywhere, but there's a lot of tension right no,w and you can see it in your feeds. A lot of people feel it. Where it's like we like the convenience of things kind of being personalized for us, but it's kind of taking away our own empowerment as individuals. So we're definitely seeing that. I think a really key demographic for an algorithm is millennials. Actually, who are the parents of Gen Alpha. Which we're going to get into today. I think they're thinking about it from their own self, how their algorithm is shaping them, but they're thinking about their children.

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Diana Kelter: Why Gen Alpha will seek out experimentation and disruption over stability and comfort 

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00:03:13

And how the algorithm is impacting that. So I think that's a perfect segue into what we're going to talk about. I love that. Okay, well, you know how this show works. I've got a game board stacked with 12 super spicy questions. You don't know what's behind them. So we'll play a little game of improv, but the power is all in your hands, my friend. So where do you want to go first? You know, my lucky number is four. So let's start with four. Let's go four. So, the cozy generation or the crazy generation. Is Gen Alpha more likely to seek out simplicity and comfort or experimentation and disruption? I love this question. I will say I'm a cozy individual, but I am not Gen Alpha.

00:04:01

I'm going to say they are definitely the experimentation and disruption generation. And I think there's some key reasons why I think that. So when we look at Gen Z, they were kind of brought into social media when they were already in middle school, high school. And so it was kind of a shift in how they were able to adapt to it, deal with it. While also still being expected to. Kind of live in the world that was very still, traditional, and structured. And that was kind of, I think, brought a lot of anxiety for them, a lot of change. And so they're kind of looking for their cozy retreats. Way to kind of adapt to that. Gen Alpha in comparison, was born on screens. They've kind of adapted to it from the start.

00:04:45

So they really it's just what they know. And so, in that sense, it isn't really giving them the same anxiety from that perspective that we've seen from past generations, like Gen Z specifically, that kind of had to adapt to it like a core developmental stage. So I think that is one reason they're just kind of able to feel that. That straightforward aspect of how they engage and that comfort with adapting to that world. But also I think when we look at their habits with gaming, and how they're engaging with content in line. They love to build and kind of make things work for them. I think they are going to kind of follow something we saw with Gen Z and social platforms, like, if a platform like Instagram, for instance, didn't have a feature.

00:05:34

They like, they kind of make a way to hack themselves. The platform itself would catch up and be like, 'Oh, we're going to create a close friends feature because we see Gen Z's doing that already. I think Gen Alpha is going to take that to the next level. And they're gonna wanna be understanding how things work behind the scenes. They're going to want to shape. They have that already with like the Roblox platforms and the gaming platforms. So I think they just having that structure from the start of being adapted to technology, understanding it. They're going to have a lot of power to kind of be disruptive. and experimental. And I think imagination is just huge for this group. So I lean towards that more than coziness. I like that.

00:06:13

I like that. I mean, even so, I have a 10-year-old, a seven-year-old, a four-year-old. And even my four-year-old is very savvy on a phone or any kind of device. And I know sometimes it's really frowned upon, like you let your kids on devices and shame on me, maybe. But also, she's also learning, and she is building communities. And she designs things, and we work on her alphabet on devices. And, you know, like old school, man, like the flashcards and things like that. You really don't even necessarily need that stuff anymore because. She's really sophisticated even at the age of four. I don't know if you get asked this question a lot, but I think about it as a mom, like the dark side of that too and like overuse of technology.

00:06:59

And I don't know if you have any advice or thoughts on that. Yeah, I definitely think, I mean, and that's why I think we see millennials as that core generation feeling the push and pull of technology and where they still feel like they have influence to kind of control how their kids engage with technology. I think that. To your point, it is here. Like it's better to have kids. Engage with it and understand it so they feel confident in having that digital literacy of critical thinking and understanding what's safe and what's not safe and understanding we are entering a misinformation world and AI, we're already all feeling that when we're online and like, is that a real image? Is that AI-generated? So I think. Kids, in many ways, I think, parents all feel that tension.

00:07:49

I have a six-year-old niece, and so sometimes she knows how to use her iPad better than me, and she just knows how to navigate it and shape it. I for parents is that stress of, are we going to be able to keep up with our kids and understand how they're using these tools? So I definitely think it's definitely good to have them feel part of that world, but also talk to them and understand that we have a really great data point at Mintel that 41% of millennial parents who have children under 18 at home. So there might be a few Gen Zers in that data. But broadly, they said the thing that they like their kids like to engage with them around is social media conversation.

00:08:29

So it was really highlighting, I think, that there is this kind of opening, I think, for parents to talk to their kids about some of the social trends that are happening, understand it, create dialogue around it. Millennials have their own version of social media, Gen Alphas putting their own spin on it. I know the six, seven thing is everywhere and it means nothing, but kids love it. So I definitely think it's, there can be opportunity to use it as conversation. Good. Good advice. All right, let's go back to the game board. 

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Diana Kelter: Marketing strategies in response to the anti-algorithm movement 

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Let's do 10. Okay, number 10. In 2026, CMOs need to consider the tension between efficiency and intimacy. How can brands win by appealing more to emotion rather than logic?

00:09:16

This is another great question that ties in perfectly to some of our 2026 predictions, which another one we have is the affection deficit. Um, I think really kind of connects with anti-algorithm because we are kind of being put in our bubbles online and we're not having those same uh opportunities for affection like we once did. And I think we're seeing more with, like, we're talking, we're going to a kiosk instead of a barista, or we're just, we're slowly seeing those moments that give us um the kind of effort we put into engaging with one another. Slowly pull away. And the question is, where do we preserve those opportunities for affection? And how are we going to see that go down, trickle down to these young kids who are kind of like we've talked about growing up with the digital world at their fingertips?

00:10:11

And I do think. We always see the pendulum swing one way. So we are heading towards the dark side of optimization if things don't go changing because optimization is everywhere. We're seeing it, people just kind of pushing. to get results and everyone's kind of feeling the scramble of how fast things move and how quickly things are changing. But I think when we pull back what people are actually looking for, it's joy. It's playfulness. It's that feeling of like unexpected. delights. I think that is what people are truly craving. And the observations we track at Mintel really demonstrate that. There's this craving from brands to bring that childhood-like play to life or sensory marketing is huge right now because that makes people feel something a little bit more tangible and cozy.

00:11:07

If we go back to that word. So I do think that, well, yes, the broader world is pushing us to be efficient and driven. A good strategy that starts with emotion will get those results in hearing. Like if you are feeling, if you create a connection to feeling. Generally, the results follow. So I think we have to find that balance of where we can bring in. Human emotion and make people feel something and still feel like they have interest, like people have interesting things to say. And I think sometimes they want to be heard in a way that doesn't just go into the void of social media. Definitely think now more than ever, if we want to pull back from that kind of dark side of optimization where we're losing touch with feeling and connection, now is the time to really start finding that balance of where we can bring in human emotion.

00:11:59

I think that's really good advice for brands. Like right now, everybody's kind of working on their 2026 plans and the vision and what they want to do. And I think what a great rallying cry to bring more emotion to your marketing at a time when it feels a bit void of it. At Curiosity, we have our creative philosophy— so to speak— is what we call art in overalls. And the art is the emotion, right? And the overalls is kind of that function, the purpose. But you have to have both. You know, you can't just be all overalls all the time. You really have to bring that artistic, emotional expression to the consumer, make them feel something. Whether it's humor or joy, like you said.

00:12:40

So I think, yeah, what a great challenge for brands to think through what is that emotion that we really want to play up this year. Exactly. And I think it's a way for brands to stand out because something we talk about in anti-algorithm is there's this kind of loop everyone gets stuck in because the algorithm loves patterns. And it loves predictability so when something goes viral, it highlights that and brings attention to it, but then every brand is kind of chasing that lifestyle that it encompasses, and it's hard to stand out because it's all chasing the same lifestyle. But when you do have that moment to kind of separate and find that moment of feeling, it's kind of like an unexpected delight to the consumer. I've been asked this from some clients.

00:13:25

It's like, are consumers open to unexpected? We're all stressed. We're all like, looking for kind of a day to go as we planned without something popping off. But when it's unexpected joy, that's different. I think people love a moment where they just get that. That smile during the day that they didn't expect so there's a key distinction between unexpected chaos and unexpected joy and I think brands that can deliver on that unexpected joy have an opportunity to win. Great. All right, let's go back to the board. 

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Diana Kelter: How brands can act as guests and not landlords in consumer spaces

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Okay, let's do six. Okay. Number six, what are the best examples of brands being guests, not landlords, in digital platforms and in social spaces? Yes, I get this question often— how do brands enter a space without feeling like they're bringing too much commercialization or overtaking a very community-driven space?

00:14:21

I always like to say brands that I think do this well and authentically are in the fitness category. If you think about, like, running shoe brands, REI, I know, gets a lot of loyalty from the way they host events in store and really own being experts in outdoor recreation. But I definitely think. I'm going to speak on running brands because it's a little bit of a personal anecdote. But I am in a lot of run clubs in Austin, Texas. It's a big running area. And often they have running. companies from Brooks or up-and-coming brands join the run club and do a little promotion you can try on the shoes for the run and use that. And it feels very authentic because they are runners themselves. They're bringing in spokespeople who are part of that community.

00:15:11

So it doesn't feel like this outsider coming in; it's just another runner who happens to be promoting the shoe brand, and so it's an authentic conversation. It doesn't feel like just a salesperson coming in. I think that model is what other brands need to think about when they think about who is their spokesperson. Who are they sending as an ambassador? Is it someone who's authentically part of that community? Maybe they just have a love of that brand and they can be your spokesperson, authentically in that space. Obviously, digitally, I think it's the same thing. I think it's about making sure you have someone who knows the language they use, knows that they kind of, maybe, have different buzzwords they use. Because I think that's what a lot of people feel online is like.

00:15:58

There's some, especially Reddit, I think, is a space where a lot of people feel intimidated by, because their core community is there. But I think, if you have an ambassador as part of your brand who is part of that community already, they can represent your brand, but also be authentic to that community. So I think it's about balancing. Who you have being your person, whether it's the community manager behind the scenes, or, like I said, just an ambassador that you're kind of being part of your brand. I think that's a way for brands to do it authentically. Do you have an example of when it's not done well, like what can happen, or, you know, a brand that has acted a little bit more like a landlord? Anything come to mind?

00:16:41

I'm trying to think of an example off the top of my head. Um. I don't want to call out any brands, but I think if anything comes off too salesy, I think it's going to be a negative if it's very clear that you're just coming in. With um. kind of language that is very corporate or very traditional, like almost scripted. I think people see through that very quickly. don't feel the benefits of it. So I just think of avoiding kind of corporate language. I think the community managers that I see perform the best are the ones. That don't have to go through like content planning and are kind of given the freedom to just riff. Um, like I've just seen so much content around Duncan and how they just go kind of chaotic and it works for their brand because people, it feels like something people would hear from, like a friend, even though it's a brand, it feels like they're making people.

00:17:41

Feel like if you know, you know, kind of dialect— so I think Duncan Wendy's was kind of the originator of doing that, like going a little off script. Um, but I think community managers that are given that freedom to just decide what spaces they should engage in and how they engage, definitely see different results. And they can go wrong, but I think it generally gives them the freedom to kind of just be part of digital conversation. Yeah, yeah. And what I hear you saying is like, don't come in and be like, 'I own the place,' right? Just come in and be part of the community, add value. collaborate, acknowledge, you know. Yes. Very cool. All right. Let's go back to the board. Let's do eight. Number eight.

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Diana Kelter: What draws Gen Alpha, a digital generation, to in-store shopping

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00:18:27

With product discovery now driven by social media, what in-store experiences actually captivate and convert Gen Alpha? That's a great question. I definitely think we still see. I mean, I feel like years ago, there would be scenes like 'brick and mortar is dead and ever you know. Here we are. We are not losing brick and mortar. And I think every generation still loves the aspect of shopping and the camaraderie that comes from that. The experience of it. But I think what's specifically interesting for Gen Alpha, they are a unique generation in that I believe they've really skipped the tween stage that we've seen from as a millennial. There was a core tween stage, there was brands and stores that really catered to the tweens, whether it was limited to Lip Smackers, which was kind of a beauty brand that only catered to like a millennial audience.

00:19:23

And what was unique about the tween brands is they were specific to that generation, but they were a little bit more, maybe, affordable than some of the more premium brands. They were really just kind of something parents could understand that was for their children. With Gen Alpha, they kind of want what everyone else has. They are exposed to what's out there. They are exposed to all these products. So we've seen the Sephora Gen Alpha conversations about how they loved the same products that any consumer was using in the beauty space. Drunk Elephant was obviously a big one. And so they're kind of watching what everyone else, from probably people in their 20s to their 30s, is using and how it trickles down to be of interest for them.

00:20:07

We've seen it with, like, the Stanley Cup, all these different aesthetics. But I think what really is impactful from an in-store experience is that aesthetic focus. They are a generation. I have a report presentation that I do around Gen Alpha, that's called 'Living in the Aesthetics' and how they are a generation exposed to the power of aesthetics in just a different way than past generations have, because it's shaping them through the value it holds. It's a sense of value when something has a premium aesthetic. It's connected to wellness. There's a different connection to how it connects to their sense of confidence. And it just is something much deeper for them— how it's showcasing. Status, currency in their school room, like, oh, if you have this color or this product.

00:20:58

So I think, from an in-store experience, if brands can tap into the power of aesthetics, that's really going to stand out. Not just from a shopping experience, but in terms of the products they gravitate to. And just really thinking collaboratively. I think Gen Alpha is going to be a generation. That doesn't think in silos— they're not gonna go shopping for one category and expect just that category. I think there's going to be a lot of blurring of lines of how they shop online and in stores. We're already seeing this with, like, sensory being a bridge. So a scent they love in there may be soap. They also are experiencing— in the food they consume. And I know they're probably not doing laundry, but we're seeing that with laundry care.

00:21:50

Like it just carries over into all these different areas of their life. And so I think sensory aesthetic is just something that's going to captivate them. I mean, I can validate all of this. Drunk Elephant, now Lululemon. I'm like, oh my goodness. How did we get here so fast? You're only 10, but. I mean, they're seeing it in school. They're seeing it online. Yeah, and they kind of have skipped that middle phase. And my daughter will even say the phrase, 'that's so aesthetic.' I'm like, 'She uses it in that way.' If she sees something that matches her need, she'll say, 'that's so aesthetic.' So it's actually become a descriptor for her of something that she likes or enjoys or appreciates. Yeah, that's fascinating. Fascinating.

00:22:34

So I imagine, like, product design and things like that, are all impacted by this trend as well. Yes, definitely. I think, because I think that's well, that's what's interesting, because I think for Gen Alpha, it's the product design and aesthetic that they're gravitating to. So, because I don't think kids know about retinol or actually what's in these skincare products, but they knew they needed that specific type to fit in. Like, they needed the mini jar or they needed the kind that had this branding outside. That's what they were focusing on. But, from gradually, parents start to think like, 'whoa,' like actually this is dangerous for your skin or maybe you don't need like hyaluronic acid at eight. So that's where we saw brands.

00:23:19

Now we're in the beauty space where they're kind of trying to cater to that. Aesthetic playfulness that Gen Alpha is craving, but also cater to parents who want to make sure they're getting products that are age appropriate. So we've been seeing a big shift from, like, Kiehl's and some other beauty brands where they have the playful, like, headbands and the fun packaging, but it's just like. Hygienic hygiene-focused items like sun care or face wash so really helping them feel like they're still getting the aesthetics, but then parents feel a little bit more secure, like, 'Okay, this isn't going too deep.' Yes, yeah, I agree. 

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Diana Kelter: Gen Alpha’s relationship with AI 

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All right, great. Let's go back to the board. Let's do question one. The oversaturation of AI chatbots and agents has Gen Alpha craving messy, real human contact.

00:24:09

How should CMOs take note? Yes, this is a question that I actually had a really interesting conversation around yesterday. Kind of like the balancing act of AI. Acting like a friend for not just young people, but for all of us, the way we kind of are thinking about AI in a different way. Our data at Mattel said 29% of consumers familiar with AI have used it in the past three months for companionship or kind of that friendship line. By and large, we still see consumers view AI as like a tool, a resource, not a friend. But I think that percent is really important to take note of because that's the people who are admitting they're using it as companionship. I think there's a lot of people who are, but there's still that stigma of saying like.

00:25:04

In some cases, oh, I use AI as my therapist. Like I think people are still realizing how to balance that kind of way we're looking to AI for what we would traditionally view as a personal role in our lives that we would treat it as a friend or a therapist or a parent. But I think from a human perspective, I think what we need to stress, and I think brands have a key role to play in this, what I was hearing from the conversation yesterday was people saying it's just more efficient to get results from like an AI, whether it's ChatGPT or any kind of chatbot you're using. If you ask a question and it's more immediate. And you sometimes feel like that's actually a really good answer.

00:25:45

It's a lot less biased than a human would be. And so people really love that. But what we're not giving space for is reflection and time to process and think. Take the time to let your brain kind of wander a little bit. So I definitely think there is an opportunity for brands to promote what it means when you let that space exist because right now we're viewing it as a negative. If you're not moving fast, you're falling behind. But is there room to kind of balance? That reflection period that we're all losing because sometimes that's when you do get that amazing idea and moment that you wouldn't have had if you're just relying on that instant gratification.

00:26:32

So I just think kind of giving room for that reflection period and reminding people to not— i think mindfulness isn't a term that's been used so much now—um, so maybe giving a different branding to stand out, but I think like reflection is a great thing: allowing ourselves to have to sit with something and process something is an opportunity to kind of inwardly find more connection. Then, how people express that. Is there any data on Gen Alpha and their desire or lack thereof for AI-generated content in terms of advertising? I mean, we've all heard the backlash of, you know, many, many campaigns. I've had a few guests on the podcast talk about campaigns. They've actually been a part of that, you know, even received some, you know, hate or discomfort.

00:27:25

Is Gen Alpha, do you believe, are they going to be the same or are they more comfortable with it than we are? It is interesting. We generally see younger consumers always being more open to technology than older consumers. largely because once you reach a certain age, your habits are formed, and you know what you know. You know so changing having to adapt to something new is trickier. Whereas younger consumers are more pliable. They're still, they just have that curiosity. They're still learning. So in general, we always see they have a little bit more openness to technology and how they can shape it, be part of it, engage with it. I think Gen Alpha is probably a little too young to have strong opinions on AI because it's just kind of them— probably using AI, not even sometimes realizing it's AI.

00:28:17

I think Gen Z is a little bit more interesting because they're both. I've talked to some students who are Gen Z and I definitely feel the push and pull. Whereas sometimes they're an anxious generation, and so sometimes I've heard them. AI helps take all the thoughts that are floating in their head and put it into a structured to-do list. So in that sense, I think they value AI. But then I heard, and other Gen Zers say, it's threatening something I connect to my core identity, which was like creating headlines or something. They thought that was a skill they really excelled at. And they were like, 'Well, I don't want to outsource that to this technology.' So it was really what I saw— is like when it can help take your anxiety off your plate and give you a little bit more structure.

00:29:01

It was a win. When it challenged what they valued about themselves, that's where the tension existed. So, from an advertising perspective, which I think people have increasingly viewed as like self-expression, deeper reflection of who you are. We might see some of that push and pull from consumers, even younger consumers who feel like, well, maybe I want to have a job one day that's doing that. Or what does it say about me? So I think that's where we will see some pushback. I know there were headlines about Dove, I think, doing anti-A campaigns recently. I think we'll see a lot of conversation from brands about how they. how they're transparent about AI and how consumers respond to it. I mean, is that the advice to CMOs right now?

00:29:49

I definitely think if brands aren't transparent, nowadays consumers find it anyway. Or I think what's even more risky is making consumers have assumptions. Consumers aren't afraid to share their thoughts no matter what proof they have. So if something even appears AI and you're not calling that out, I think consumers are going to make their own narrative around that. And the last thing a brand wants is to not own their narrative. Um, so I think transparency and owning, just making sure you're owning the conversation from start to finish, is the key thing I would stress to CMOs right now because it's so easy to put a campaign out there. And if you're not in control of it, it will so quickly get taken over by feedback, people have or people making it kind of bringing their own spin to it.

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Diana Kelter: A few of the core themes that make up Gen Alpha’s identity 

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00:30:39

Yeah. Yeah. Good. Okay. Let's go back to the board. Let's do three. Okay. In what ways might Gen Alpha redefine concepts like identity, beauty, belonging, and how can brands evolve to keep up? So I definitely think we are going to see this take a lot of different forms. So right now, with what they've been witnessing from Gen Z, is how self-expression has not just come from the traditional categories. So it used to be clothing and beauty, kind of owned self-expression. And then we've gradually seen a lot of food and drink brands step up with how they are shaping self-expression. Because it's funny when, like, back in 2016, I was a food service analyst here at Mintel. And that's when we really saw a lot of food service brands do kind of merchandise.

00:31:34

So it was KFC, it was McDonald's, it was before Dunkin' was really doing this heavily. But they were doing like a sweatshirt launch or something. And it was very gimmicky. It wasn't like competing with a traditional clothing retailer. But gradually they would keep doing these drops or launches and then it would evolve more and more and it started getting a little bit more premium. Sometimes, it was like a hundred-dollar sweatshirt or it was something desirable and it was different price points and then suddenly I think clothing retailers are like whoa Like they're taking a purchase away from us. We need to find a way to merge worlds. So suddenly, we saw every kind of fashion retailer using food and drink as their inspiration for self-expression.

00:32:19

I would walk by, like Anthropologie's window display, and it had strawberries in it and cherries and cheese, and it was all food-focused. Nordstrom did like a farmer's market appeal for one of their collections. Gradually, we were just, I was just seeing more and more. And we see this in beauty too, like road beauty has food in all of their Instagram pictures. Food and drink was suddenly just owning and dominating what self-expression looked like, where it came from. And so I think that. Blurring of worlds is something that Gen Alpha has witnessed. Gen Z kind of inspires. And I think Gen Alpha is going to just bring a totally new dimension to self-expression and where it comes from. Are just, like I said, they're not viewing categories in silo.

00:33:08

It's all kind of blurred as culture and just coming at them from different places, different sources. But I think what we're going to see Gen Alpha push back on are these core trends like grandma core or Western core and fairy core, and these things that just kind of pop up and then they disappear again. They pop up, and they disappear. I think they're going to feel a little bit overwhelmed by some of these trends as they get older, and because they're going to have that comfortability with AI and the power AI has to personalize things and shape things and take. Something that they've designed and turn it into a more tangible product, whether it's nail art or a jacket you wear, I think they're going to be more taste makers in their own right and maybe stand out independently a little bit more.

00:33:59

So we could see influence shift from right now, it's kind of like you have your core influencers online and it's like one to many. Becoming like a many to many where everyone kind of is like individual taste makers in a different way. And that will be something I think to watch for in the next couple of years. The oldest Gen Alphas are 14. So the oldest, the tip-top of Gen Alpha is just starting high school. And we know what happens in high school: people want to express who they are, find themselves, and really revolt against things that older consumers love. So I think we're right at the precipice of counter trends coming from Gen Alpha. And how they approach engaging online, how they approach identity.

00:34:42

So right now they've kind of been little either mini millennials or Gen Z kind of followers, but the oldest set of Gen Alphas are about to kind of find themselves. And then I think the youngest Gen Alphas will look up to them. So we're right on the precipice of their counter-trend moment. That's interesting. Any advice for CMOs as they're kind of navigating this counter-trend movement? What should they be thinking or doing? I think understanding the themes of Gen Alpha will be key, versus kind of clinging to the products and brands they love right now. We know. Young kids are fickle: what they like today they might not like tomorrow. So paying less attention to the specifics that they're clinging to, and those higher-level themes of category blurring, being probably intrinsic to who they are, self-expression.

00:35:36

Evolving, but still being something that is core to how they're going to want to shape who they are. And I think just the fact that they are going to be more imaginative and in the weeds of understanding. Because, like I said, they're not really just users of social media. They want to be creators, and they want to understand. Understand things. So I think keeping an eye on the fact that they're going to be imaginative and they're going to want that kind of blurred aspect of connecting with products are the things I would focus on. Kind of, anticipating what is trendy with millennials and Gen Z, maybe expect the opposite. Young kids like to be contrarians. They just, it's a tale as old as time. So maybe prepare for that counter trend to what Gen Z loves them.

00:36:26

We saw Gen Z turn on millennials. So we always see it. There's going to be that counter trend. That's why I part my hair in the middle now, I guess. Have to deal with that at some point. Gen Z should be ready. They're going to become the target. Okay. All right. I'm ready. All right. 

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Diana Kelter: Why the infamous American Eagle ad with Sydney Sweeney delivered business gains despite clashing with Gen Z and Gen Alpha views

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Let's go back to the board. Alright, let's do nine. Okay. Number nine, American Eagle faced backlash for overlooking cultural context in a recent ad, yet its stock rose 25%. If the ad clashed with Gen Z and Gen Alpha values, why do you think it still delivered business gains? Yeah, this is something we see a lot in our data from younger consumers and kind of the development of the moral brand that we've seen since kind of the early 2010s, and the way brands reflect more values now than eve,r and how consumers kind of respond to that.

00:37:24

But I think what's interesting to remember is there's a big gap in what consumers say and what they do. We really saw this a lot with gender. Z when they were a little bit younger. So, around 2017 to 2018, right before the pandemic, really, we all were talking about Gen Z being the sustainable generation, how much they were going to change the conversation and be this empowering generation. And while that was, they were actively communicating that, it didn't mean they weren't using products and services that were bad for the environment, or they still valued convenience. They still valued kind of, we saw Gen Z being fast fashion consumers. So it was like what they were saying. bringing to life didn't always match their behaviors and habits.

00:38:15

And we have the data that would kind of reflect that balance of like, okay, they're saying they have this value, but it conflicts with some of their other goals of, like I said, convenience or having that. That shirt, that was a little bit more affordable. We know that kind of decision plays into it. So I think, from the American Eagle perspective, it's that matter of, we really don't see boycotts actually take hold, like in some cases we would assume in our marketing to Gen Z report. We ask, have you boycotted a brand? in the past six months because you didn't align with your values or maybe changed your habit. And there was a stronger percent that said no versus yes.

00:38:57

So we even see what that cohort that's kind of been at the heart of this kind of development of the moral brand, not necessarily boycotting, as we would think. So I think this is something that plays into what we talk about in the affection deficit. It's like it's very easy to get to know or kind of noticed and have a voice online, and that's kind of the commodity. Sometimes brands are kind of building is just having an opinion, having a hot take, or saying something. But then how that actually translates to your behavior and how long that actually holds— I think is less tracked. So right, there was that kind of controversy. And a lot of people threatened to boycott.

00:39:43

But then we also saw some people who didn't like what they would call woke culture. So they went there out of principle. So we definitely see there's always that push and pull. Sometimes it does drive people in store. There might be some consumers that pull away and it kind of balances out. And in this case, I think it netted out as they took a risk in kind of bringing this conversation to life, but it drove conversation. It made them part of the news story. And I think gradually, another brand becomes the headline, and then it doesn't really matter. It's just about, then it comes about, do you have the clothes and the quality to back up? Cause that kind of conversation, it lifted them.

00:40:26

But then, when we get to a point where another brand is in the hot seat. Are consumers still connecting with your core product, because then the controversy is not driving people in anymore? Is there still something that's going to maintain their interests? So I think that's where brands can kind of spark conversation. And engage some, you know, be in that hot seat for better or worse. But that only lasts so long. So I don't think that can be. A full strategy brands take— they still have to have products when people launch, and they have to have loyal customers. They have to make sure they're giving them that loyalty, so I think that's the law. Longer term, the game is don't just rely on those hot take moments because people are fickle and they can only cling to that story for so long.

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Diana Kelter: How CMOs can earn trust from Gen Alpha

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00:41:09

Good advice. All right. Last one. Let's go. Where are we going to end? Last one. Let's see. Let's do lucky number seven. Okay. Number seven, stealth marketing is a huge red flag for Gen Alpha. What are some ways CMOs can earn trust and grow their following? Yeah, I think with Gen Alpha, it's going to be I think it's going to be a learning curve for them. I don't think we can just assume what worked for Gen Z is going to work for them. I do think they're going to, like I said, bring a lot of imagination to the table, and they're going to be more savvy than I think we're prepared for, just because they do know how to navigate online. They're going to be.

00:41:59

AI users from a much younger age, they're just going to know how to think about terms and words. So I definitely think we've talked about transparency, but also just bringing them in to the fold, like making them feel part of that world. I think is going to be like making them feel like taste makers, making them feel like they understand. the whole journey of a product the whole component of it i think they're just good at they are online users they're ingrained in brands in a way that every not every generation has been and i think just bringing them into the fold more and more. I mean, I think brands have been getting ahead of this generation. I think some narratives I've heard is we were a little too late on Gen Z.

00:42:47

We want to make sure we understand Gen Alpha from the start, and we're just kind of things move faster. Things move quicker. So I think just what they're doing is a good start. Like understanding them, obviously, there's you know challenges. You want to market to kids. So it's more just a learning stage right now. And I think that is what brands should be doing is just understanding them and taking notes of, how is this generation thinking? How are they processing? And what is that going to mean as they age and want to be part of that brand experience? Because they are. They are kind of thinking of brands more as friends. Like when we were growing up, it really they were kind of friend, but not in the cultural way that we see now.

00:43:29

Where brands just shape uh, they do shape culture in different ways. So I think just understanding that deep influence and the expectations I think younger consumers have for brands that's something that we've been seeing for quite some time. Like Brands aren't just this transactional experience anymore. They are just deeply embedded in lifestyles and expression. So being prepared for that. That is a great statement to end on. Brands are friends for this generation. I think if you have that mindset as you go into planning, you will make very different decisions, I think, than if you go in thinking, you know, I'm the landlord, this is a transaction, and I'm in control. Yeah. Awesome. Man, this has been so fun. I feel like I've learned a lot about this generation.

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Diana Kelter: Closing remarks

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00:44:15

I'm really excited to see them grow and see how they contribute, honestly, to the world. Probably a faster, more productive, and I don't know, like a even like more remarkable way, I think, than any generations past. So very, very cool. We will link to all of the research and everything that you've said today in case any of our listeners want to get a deeper look. So we love to end our podcast with a little this or that. Super fast, just to get to know you a little bit more. It's the first one that comes to mind. You don't have to overthink it. Are you ready? Okay. Okay. Alright, here we go. Pinterest board or trend report? I'm going to go Pinterest board. I love Pinterest. All right. Texas barbecue or Tex-Mex?

00:45:09

I'm gonna say Tex-Mex. Tex-Mex, okay. Fortnite or Roblox? Oh, you know, gaming is my weakness, but I'm going to say Roblox. Okay. All right. I don't have any experience with Fortnite either. A book club or a running club? Definitely running club. I knew you were going to say that. Six, seven, or group seven? Oh, you know, I'm going to say group seven. All right, this has been a total blast. What's the best way for listeners to get a hold of you if they want to reach out? I would say LinkedIn is a great place. You can find me at Diana Kelter. I also do a weekly newsletter on LinkedIn called The Mindful Drift, where I kind of promote the power of daydreaming. So we talked about taking time to reflect. If you're interested in doing that, maybe my newsletter can inspire you. Awesome. Thank you so much for coming on the show. I really appreciate it.

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